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<title>AskPhilosophers.org | "Logic"</title>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Logic - Alexander George responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ I studied philosophy in university and I recall that one of my tutors for symbolic logic was trying to walk me through a problem by saying that if you have a large enough set of premises, two of them will inevitably contradict one another. I've always had trouble understanding (and consequently, accepting) this proposition because: if one conceives of reality as a set of claims (e.g., I am right-handed, electron X is in position Y, 2 + 2 = 4, etc.) there are an infinite number of "premises" to the "argument" that is reality and consequently reality is self-contradictory. Am I missing something here? Can you explain which of us is right about this and in which sense? I should mention that I don't necessarily have a problem with reality being self-contradictory, but that really throws symbolic logic out the window (and doesn't throw it out the window at the same time)! Thanks to all respondents for their time.<br><br>-JAK
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Response from: Alexander George<br />

<blockquote>I'm not sure what your tutor was getting at either.  If your tutor meant that one can always enlarge a set of premises to make it an inconsistent set, that's obviously true: simply add the negation of one of the premises already in the set.  If he meant that any axiom system with infinitely many premises (say, one that employs an axiom schema) is inconsistent, then there's no reason to believe that.</blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2164</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Mind, Logic - Mitch Green responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ Many claims about what is possible or logical seem to rest on what is conceivable to the human mind. But what reason do we have to believe that there's any link between the way our minds work and the way things actually are?
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Response from: Mitch Green<br />

<blockquote><p>Thank you for your question.  For a long while in the history of philosophy it was thought that what was conceivable was a good indication of what was possible.  Descartes is a good example of this way of thinking, though he was careful to require that not any old conceiving of a thing showed it to be possible.  Rather he required that the conceiving had to be "clear and distinct", meaning roughly that it had to pass the most stringent standards we can muster to make sure the conceiving is coherent (i.e., not subtly self-contradictory).   In the middle of the 20th century this methodology began to break down.  For instance, in the Sixties Hilary Putnam distinguished between concepts and properties, making clear that our concepts of things like gold may not reveal its true properties.  Similarly, Kripke's notion a decade later of "natural kinds" made room for the possibility that what is "metaphysically possible" may not correspond to that is conceivable.  </p><p> This issue is still a topic of intense debate.  Some philosophers in the last decade or so have argued that conceivability considerations have *some* force in determining what is genuinely possible.  For instance, see Frank Jackson's, <em>From Metaphysics to Ethics: A Defense of Conceptual Analysis</em>, Oxford University Press, 1997.  I should mention that conceivability does seem an important tool for many fields, not just philosophy: for instance, physics uses thought experiments regularly.  Those "experiments" are constrained by what we know of the laws of physics, but philosophers' thought experiments can take into account all we know also about the empirical world.  Imagine, further, how hard it would be to reason in ethics or political philosophy without being about to construct thought experiments!  The moral here is that conceivability considerations are not aimed at finding out about our minds, but rather are our attempts to use common sense, albeit fallibly, to find out about the world.<br /> </p><p>Mitch Green </p></blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2143</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Science, Logic - Marc Lange responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ To whom it may concern; <br><br>I thank you in advance for your assistance. I had a discussion with some of my colleagues regarding a problem that I identified. Basically, I got two different and contradictory results of the same problem (i.e., a paradox) using different but equally valid methodologies and rationales in our area of research. I propose to resolve this paradox by making some adjustments to the methodologies in order to make them consistent. As you know, when paradoxes are found, solutions have to be advanced in order to resolve the inconsistencies, and this in turn strengthens the whole methodology. <br><br>The problem is that I identified the aforementioned paradox by means of a simulated, laboratory-type of study, in which ideal conditions are assumed and simulated. Since my area of research is business studies, my colleagues allege that the “paradox” I found is not valid, because it is not based on data from real firms. They added that for the paradox to be valid, real data would have to be used. I argue that on the contrary, the problems raised by the paradoxical situation I found are very likely to “get worse”, so to speak, in studies with real firms, since the data and conditions under which those studies are run are going to be far from the ideal situation I simulated. In short, my argument is that “if it is bad under ideal situations and conditions (i.e., lab study), it can only get worse when less than ideal situations and conditions are expected (i.e., studies with real firms), thus the paradox I found is even more relevant in studies with real data”. <br><br>The last sentence in the above paragraph is based on my own logic and intuition. It makes so much sense to me, that I am surprised that my colleagues do not see it that way. Therefore, I would like to know if there is any “theorem” or “law” or “argument” in the philosophy and/or logics fields that would back up my rationale. Since my area of research is an empirical field mainly, I thought that maybe there is a logical or philosophical argument, theorem or law that would assert something along the lines of “if the results obtained by a lab study (i.e., ideal conditions) are inconsistent, an empirical study with real firms (i.e., less than ideal conditions) are expected to be also inconsistent”. <br><br>I apologize for perhaps not using the appropriate terminology and concepts, and also for the lengthy question. <br><br>I hope you can help me with my query.<br><br>Regards.
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Response from: Marc Lange<br />

<blockquote><p>I don't think that there is or could be a general principle that says that a paradox arising from idealizations will inevitably carry over (much less become worse) when the idealizations are relaxed. In some cases, the paradox will disappear when the idealizations are removed. In other cases, the paradox will persist (or become worse). There is no general rule here. It depends entirely on the details of the case.</p>  <p>For example, various paradoxes result in classical electromagnetic theory when pointlike charged particles are used. Point charges are a convenient idealization for many purposes, but the energy in such a field is undefined (the integral blows up). However, if we go to charge densities and extended charged bodies rather than point charges, these problems disappear. Likewise, in cosmology, Newtonian gravitational theory is afflicted with various paradoxes if we assume an infinite universe with a homogeneous, isotopic distribution of matter. Remove these idealizations and the problems go away.</p>  <p>These are intended merely as examples to show that sometimes paradoxes arise because of the idealization. In other cases, they arise despite the idealization. The matter can only be resolved in a case-by-case way, given the details of the particular paradox.</p>  <p>  </p></blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2159</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Language, Logic - Peter Smith responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ Are there any reasons to think that any one language is better suited to reasoning than another? Are there ways in which we could change our language in order to make reasoning easier, or more effective, or to make us less prone to common reasoning errors?    
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Response from: Peter Smith<br />

<blockquote><p>Well, it is certainly true that introducing unambiguous, very carefully defined, agreed terminology and having a perspicuous notation can make reasoning easier and make us less prone to common reasoning errors. To take the obvious example, mathematicians aren't just being awkward when they use a lot of symbolism and make very careful distinctions wrapped up into technical terms (and borrow from the languages of formal logic to make clear, for example, the 'scope' of their quantifiers). If proofs all had to be written out in unaugmented English, then we'd get lost following them, even in elementary high school algebra: and proof-discovery would be orders of difficulty harder.</p><p>I suppose we might say "mathematicians' English" -- meaning English augmented with their new definitions and notational devices -- is a new, better, language, more suited to (mathematical) reasoning than street English. But equally, we might say that it is just one part of a single inclusive language, modern English: it is just a part that is only learnt by those with certain specialist interests. But for present purposes I can't see that it really matters which of those descriptions you prefer. The key point remains that, yes, appropriate linguistic devices, e.g. sharply defined terms and a perspicuous symbolic notation, certainly can expedite reasoning and help us avoid error.<br /></p></blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2124</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Logic - Peter Smith responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ If the same proposition is derived from two different logical processes, are the answers still the same? Or to reverse the question, can the nature of the sub-premises or lower stages of logical reasoning yield the exact same conclusion? Thank you. 
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Response from: Peter Smith<br />

<blockquote><p>Why shouldn't two different chains of reasoning lead to one and the very same conclusion? Mathematicians often give different proofs of the same result. For example,  Aigner and Ziegler's wonderful <a target="_blank" href="http://www.amazon.com/Proofs-BOOK-Martin-Aigner/dp/3540404600"><em>Proofs from the Book</em></a> starts off with <em>six</em> proofs (chosen from many more) of the same proposition, i.e. Euclid's result that there is an infinite number of prime numbers. The very different routes to the same  conclusion are illuminating, as they show up different connections between the fact that there is  an infinite number of primes and other mathematical facts. But it is one and the same mathematical proposition that the different connecting proofs all home in on.</p><p>I've chosen a mathematical example first because of the question's emphasis on "logical reasoning". But the point generalizes to cover other sorts of grounds we might have for accepting a proposition. I take it that Jill is in the coffee bar, as she has just phoned me and told me she is waiting there for me right now. You take it  that Jill is in the coffee bar as you've just glimpsed her through the window. Different routes to acquiring belief in one and the same proposition. Of course, Jill's phone call tells me other things too -- e.g. that she is cross to be kept waiting. And your glimpse tells you other things, e.g. that she is sitting in a window seat. I pick up one overall package of beliefs from my phone encounter: you pick up a different package from your glimpse. But that doesn't prevent one and the same proposition -- the proposition that she is in the coffee bar -- being in both packages. Why not?<br /> </p></blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2116</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Language, Logic, Time - Richard Heck responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ Does the law of bivalence demand that a proposition IS either true or false today? What if the truth or falsity of this proposition is a correspondence to a future event that has yet to occur?
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Response from: Richard Heck<br />

<blockquote><p>I take it that by "bivalence", you mean the principle that every proposition is either true or false. And if we take that principle in unrestricted form---we really do mean <em>every</em> proposition---then, well, it's hard to see how it could fail to imply that the proposition expressed by "There will be a riot in London on 13 January 2076" is either true or false.</p><p>If you don't like that conclusion, then you have to abandon bivalence---or, perhaps, the claim that the sentence in question expresses a proposition, though that seems rather worse. But note that you do not have to abandon bivalence, so to speak, across the board. You might still think that every <em>mathematical</em> proposition is either true or false, or that every proposition <em>about the past</em> is either true or false, or.... Perhaps there is something special about the future here.</p><p>As you probably know, Michael Dummett argued that one way to understand debates over "realism" takes them to turn upon our attitude towards bivalence regarding propositions about the subject matter in question: So a view that gave up bivalence for statements about the future would be a form of "anti-realism" about the future.<br /> </p></blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2039</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Logic, Philosophy - Alexander George responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ Is a computer conceivable that would cut down on Philosophers' work by immediately identifying logic mistakes in arguments?  For example: you enter "The Ontological argument for God" or "David Hume's argument against Inductive Reasoning" (or, for that matter, scan in the entire text of Plato's Republic) into the machine, and it immediately uses its programming (which tells it to watch out for contradiction, and all those other logic laws, etc.) and spits out the mistakes in reasoning.  Is the problem with this that it would be too difficult to program, or that the laws of logic are under respectable attack?
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Response from: Alexander George<br />

<blockquote>Philosophy would be much easier if we could program such a machine -- and boring too.  But it's not going to happen.  For one thing, there's your interesting point that philosophical disputes can go very deep, so deep as to include disagreement about what the laws of logic, of correct inference, ought to be.  Secondly, even for first-order classical logic, there simply is no computer that can decide whether any given inference is correct.  (This is known as <em>Church's Theorem</em> and was proved by Alonzo Church in 1936.)  Finally, there's the fact that evaluating the logical cogency of arguments is only a (small) part of the business of figuring out what to think about someone's argument in philosophy: at the very least, one must also understand and evaluate the <em>assumptions</em> to which the logical reasoning is applied.</blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2096</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Logic - Alexander George responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ Is logic justifiable without logic?
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Response from: Alexander George<br />

<blockquote>See <a href="http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/442" target="_blank">Question 442</a>.</blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/2016</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Logic - Peter Smith responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ If our brains evolved to be predisposed to logical fallacies like post hoc ergo propter hoc for beneficial reasons (for example, it has been suggested that susceptibility to post hoc ergo propter hoc aids in the learning of inferences), then might people be harmed if they are trained to overcome (even partially) these predispositions, as teaching them philosophy might do?  Should tests be devised for the abilities that those logical fallacies enhance, so that there is a way to determine if training is harmful?<br><br>
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Response from: Peter Smith<br />

<blockquote><p>Philosophy departments like to tell themselves (and their funding bodies!) that the study of philosophy distinctively makes their students better all-round thinkers -- in the fashionable jargon, our courses deliver special "transferable skills".</p><p>Actually, that strikes me as really a rather unlikely claim (at least if it means any more than that our students grow up, get more mature, learn not to jump to conclusions, learn how to write well-presented coherently organized papers, etc., which happens with pretty much any serious academically rigorous degree course). Anyone who has sat through scores of departmental meetings, listening to various bunches of philosophers trying to muddle through organizing their affairs, often making a complete hash of it, knows perfectly well that -- outside their research work -- even the best philosophers are no better at thinking straight and keeping their eye on the ball than anyone else. (And after those departmental meetings, are the pub conversations about politics, say, noticably any sharper and more rational with philosophers than with other smart, well-informed, people? Certainly not.)</p><p>Doing a lot of philosophy sure improves your performance at philosophy, but otherwise doesn't seem to me to have especially good effects on "cognitive skills". But -- the question asks -- could it in fact have <em>bad</em> effects? </p><p>I remember the logician Geoffrey Hunter once telling me the following story. At the beginning of his elementary formal logic course, he'd give out a sheet of sample arguments, and ask students to tick off the ones they thought were good arguments. At the end of the course, he'd give out the same sheet. And average scores <em>went down</em>.  </p><p>You can see why! Whereas at the beginning students had to think through the examples, doing the best they could, later they were tempted to be over-impressed with their shiny new half-understood formal tools, and apply them thoughtlessly, at least while in the logic classroom, forgetting (for example) all those warnings about translating "if" using the truth-functional horseshoe. <br /></p><p>Does that mean introductory logic courses should come with a health warning? Well, no: for I bet the "damage" was temporary and superficial. Once outside the formal logic classroom, students quickly forget most of what we've said --  as again any philosophy teacher knows, the same old fallacies and confusions will still tend to turn up in their other work.</p><p>So I wouldn't worry too much. I'm fairly sure that philosophy courses have little distinctive impact for good or ill on general "cognitive  skills" (which is fine by me, as the courses are, after all, supposed to be teaching <em>philosophy</em>). And I'm even more  sure that such effects that they do have don't reach down to disturb the patterns of hard-wired quick-and-dirty cognitive processing which evolution has provided us with.</p><p>However, those <em>are</em> just my guesses. It would indeed be very interesting to have some careful, well-controlled, empirical research to appeal to, which tells us about the comparative  impact that e.g. a couple of years as a philosophy major, has on general reasoning abilities. But I don't myself know of any work. Maybe some other panelist has some pointers?<br /></p></blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/1997</link>
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		<title><![CDATA[ Question about Philosophers, Logic - Peter S. Fosl responds]]></title>
		<description><![CDATA[ I believe that Kant defended the "law of cause and effect" by stating this argument: <br><br>(P) If we didn't understand or acknowledge the law of cause and effect, we couldn't have any knowledge.<br><br>(Q) We have knowledge.<br><br>Therefore: (P) we acknowledge the law of cause and effect.<br><br>Isn't this line of reasoning a fallacy? P implies Q, Q, : P
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Response from: Peter S. Fosl<br />

<blockquote>You have certainly put your finger on a complex issue.  One might say you've got a dragon by the tail.  <br /><br />First, I should call your attention to the fact that you've rendered his argument in two logically different ways.  The first rendering is actually a valid form of deductive inference, not a fallacy. Philosophers, in their pretentious way, call it a modus tollens.  The terms in which you've put it allow for this rendering:  <br /><br />1.  If Not-P, then Not-Q.<br /><br />2.  Q.<br /><br />3.  Therefore, P.<br /><br />And, by the way, that first rendering can also be restated in another valid form called a modus ponens:<br /><br />1.  If we have knowledge (Q), then we understand or acknowledge the law of cause and effect (P).<br /><br />2.  We have knowledge (Q).<br /><br />3.  Therefore, we understand or acknowledge the law of cause and effect (P).<br /><br />There's a rather large issue lurking here, too, as to what "understanding" and "acknowledging" mean, how they're similar, how they're different.  (See, for example, Stanley Cavell's, "Knowing and Acknowledging" in his book, <em>Must We Mean What We Say?</em> , Cambridge <span class="caps"><span class="caps">UP,</span></span> 1976).  But let's put that aside for the moment.<br /><br />The second rendering you present (the way you put it in your very last sentence) is, take note, different from the first; and it is indeed fallacious.  It's a fallacy known as affirming the consequent.  That second rendering might be restated this way:<br /><br />1.  If we understand or acknowledge the law of cause and effect (P), then we have knowledge (Q).<br /><br />2.  We have knowledge (Q).<br /><br />3.  Therefore, we understand or acknowledge the law of cause and effect.<br /><br />Okay, enough of the logic of your question.  More importantly, I'd like to observe that while Kant's transcendental "deduction" of the idea that general causal judgments are true in a what philosophers call an "a priori" way might be called an argument, it's an argument of a rather unusual sort.  I would caution you therefore about the risks of rendering Kant's argument in the simple deductive way you present it here.  I think this sort of rendering masks the special way he thinks he is "proving" his case.  Kant himself remarks that his proof is more akin to the judgment of a kind of legal tribunal than a proof of deductive reasoning.  At the risk of butchering Kant too much, I'd suggest you consider Kant's "deduction" as a bit closer to this rendering:<br /><br />1.  A necessary condition for the possibility of knowledge of the natural world is the a priori truth of the claim that every event in the natural world has a natural cause. (In short, scientific knowledge is possible only if the law of cause and effect is a priori true.)<br /><br />2.  Let's proceed as if scientific knowledge is possible.<br /><br />3.  It's an a priori truth that every event in nature is caused by another event in nature (i.e. that the causal law is true).<br /><br />Of course, that's a rough rendering, and I hope my colleagues will forgive me for its brutality; but note how my second premise is much more guarded than yours, and note how I emphasize that Kant is more interested in figuring out what the necessary conditions for the possibility of knowledge are than proving that we actually have knowledge.  Anyway, I hope this helps you pursue a more advanced understanding of the issue.</blockquote> ]]></description>
		<link>http://www.askphilosophers.org/question/1982</link>
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